Bayushi Satomi
Unwanted Betrothed
Scorpion Clan
Posts: 1,080| Likes: 322
Rings: Earth 4 * Fire: 5 *Air 3 * Water 1 * Void 3
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Post by Bayushi Satomi on Oct 30, 2014 13:36:19 GMT
Guys, I was looking at the Character Progression and I am under impression I was too optimistic about the post rates. I am the only who reached the Experienced I milestone so far.
I was thinking in lowering the bar so it can be more realistic and give you guys the opportunity to get an extra Ring earlier.
Currently, the numbers are:
However... I am currently over one thousand posts (therefore once I change the rules I already reached rank 2, the Proboards forum system will give me the automatic rewards). So, ethically, I couldn't simply change the rules without ask you what do you guys think. By the way, it would only be valid after the Amethyst Tournament, so it wouldn't give me an unfair advantage in the Tournament.
Opinions?
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Post by Kurimuzon Te on Oct 30, 2014 22:07:27 GMT
For all the work you do I think you deserve it.
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Bayushi Satomi
Unwanted Betrothed
Scorpion Clan
Posts: 1,080| Likes: 322
Rings: Earth 4 * Fire: 5 *Air 3 * Water 1 * Void 3
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Post by Bayushi Satomi on Oct 30, 2014 22:22:11 GMT
Question is, I'd like to see yu guys earning those rings, feeling you are progressing your characters, and so on. However some of you are too far of reaching 750 posts, and even 500 posts. I'd like to discuss a manner of rewarding for the commitment, for being around week after week, and mainly, for posting.
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Post by tsuruchi kasumi on Oct 31, 2014 9:26:49 GMT
I should be able to reach 500 posts fairly quickly, so maybe I'm not the best to comment on this either. But I don't care you getting the extra things, as we don't use them all that often anyways. I think that the first time we're ever going to use them in a systematic way will be the amethyst championship.
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Post by Shiba Kaigen on Oct 31, 2014 21:22:39 GMT
I'm not sure post count is the best way to handle things like advancement... a single long post like Odai's first one here is weighted the same as Doesn't seem... right.
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Bayushi Satomi
Unwanted Betrothed
Scorpion Clan
Posts: 1,080| Likes: 322
Rings: Earth 4 * Fire: 5 *Air 3 * Water 1 * Void 3
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Post by Bayushi Satomi on Oct 31, 2014 21:58:16 GMT
When I first signed up to play in EE2, I, as Odai, were very concerned in delivering posts with content, ambiencing and at least a few paragraphs, and not only one or two sentences. We even discussed in our private forums about word count (we felt slightly fooled, as you do, that the weight was the same). You may remember the Winter court... Well, however reality came along: sometimes a sucint post has the same effect than a wall of text. And sometimes a wall of text is just filler. Of course when a player just reacts, he's not opening "avenues" to his thread partner. A more bodied text often provides more room to the other player than a simple reaction. But I don't think we should judge "style" or "generosity with the other". In a collaborative writing as a PbP, mature players as this group will know how to dose their inputs. Right? There is a tool that permits word count. I (and the original developers of the forum) don't believe in its effectiveness or fairness. Fortunately, we have players really committed into only doing pertinent posts in the RP area, and even in the OOC area, we are not that talkative either (I'd like we would: really guys the general area is open to discussion into L5R, RPG and a lot of other related things). We have high quality players here and the maturity of the players really allows a post count to deliver Glory, which is a mean to stimulate players to create more, interact more, discuss more, etc etc. We even have a way to reward exceptional posts that is quite forgotten... is very sad when we have a week with one or two posts only. Of course, there are other means to reward exceptional roleplaying, outstanding plots and so on. I urge you guys to show up with a compelling, disturbing, exceptional plot hook able to involve others and imply in significative change on status quo that will be WORTH A RING. As I always said, minor rewards will pop up eventually. But the Experienced Title really involves a lot of posts and contributions to the setting.
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Post by tsuruchi kasumi on Nov 1, 2014 9:56:52 GMT
I don't think that the post count is that much a problem, as it takes quite a while before you reach it. And we all have some posts where we just put in a quick reply and post which are a lot more in-dept, so in the end it will average out I think. We also have to take into account that not everybody can consistently write such long posts (I know I can't) as well as that English is not everybody's first language (again, it isn't for me). Also as mentioned some of the smaller posts can contribute a lot more than some longer ones. For instance I really liked those small posts of Kaigen when we were traveling where he was musing over what to do to his horse (or the child). Not long posts, but very funny to read, which is essentially why we're here.
Also we have the mandates and indeed, the recomendation which we appear to have forgotten. While the awards of the mandates are not as great as reaching the post count, there are more of them, so again, it will average out.
I hesitate to mention this, as I'm not sure if it will work, but I know of another system that was used in a Play by email game I was in once (seems like ages ago). It worked by given points to posts, depending on lenght and what they contributed to the plot. If a player had a certain number of points, he/she got promoted (it was Star Trek). I didn't like it there because you ended up with a ship full of commanders and I'm not sure if it will work here as it requires a lot of manual work (someone has to read all the posts and keep tally), but I thought I'd mention it anyways.
And this is one of the problem I'm struggling with. I've been used to playing games which are much more structured (where the GM has a lot more control over the plot, more like table-tops, but then on a forum or by email), so I'm still adapting to the more free-form we have here. But don't worry, it'll come to me in time.
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Bayushi Satomi
Unwanted Betrothed
Scorpion Clan
Posts: 1,080| Likes: 322
Rings: Earth 4 * Fire: 5 *Air 3 * Water 1 * Void 3
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Post by Bayushi Satomi on Nov 1, 2014 11:26:58 GMT
It was already commented, but I'm going to point again that EE2 was inspired in the molds of the EE1, which was a L5R Facebook social game in the format of Mafia Wars, made by Jay back in 2011-2012. The game had a forum, and people in the forum started to PbP that had no structure at all. The players guided the main plot through votes in the social game. E.g: After successfully defending the Empire from the Yobanjin invasion in the far north, Kaneka is advised by his supporters he should be the Emperor. What advice you give him? Option 1: Yeah, let's do it buddy. Worray! Option 2: Are you crazy man? Option 3: I try to temporize Option 4: What a shame... I seppuku in protest to such stupid idea.
Another example:
Shogun Kaneka declared to be Emperor Kaneka. Toturi III declared war to the former Shogun. Which side will you choose? You decision would influence which clans would support one or other side (and people on the PbP would RP this choice and its consequences, of course). Yet another example: in the social game, Naseru allies (Crane, Scorpion, Dragon, Phoenix), weren't able to defend some cities and lost them, and then, they (we, in the case I was Crane)) lost Toshi Ranbo. There were excellent threads about this moment of defeat, victory, tragedy, violence and so on. But the point is that the events were in fact prompted by one line or two. NO GM. Just a line or two of prompt. But the PbP was a lot more evolved than just reacting to prompts. There were mods (because the numbers were nice) but as said before, no GM at all. No Storyteller and no one to RP some NPCs. It worked, and people used to rely in each other's creativity to have fun. There were a few isolated problems, mostly with jerks, but in a big picture, it worked. That's what is expected here again. The GM is around more as a tool to help crowd and support players plots (afterall, we not always can RP our own characterer's enemies, etc) and help to flesh out their ideas; to help organize the prompts, timeline and sometimes act as a mod (we didn't really needed such to this date, right?).
Having a traditional GM around it's too costly (unless someone volunteer to be available in a constant basis, and of course deliver consistent plot able to engage everyone), and sometimes, even restraining (we probably wouldn't have a nice and loose side story as Kasumi and Kaigen's travel, just to give an example).
We more or less have the points per posts system here. The glory system establish the average reward per post (just to remember, Glory turns into "favors", "items" and in special cases, "raises"), when a good plotting WILL be rewarded with a Trait. After a number of posts (currently 750,1500 and 3000) you reach the Experienced Levels. That's exactly which I propose to discuss here. Is the current system to measure who is Experienced enough to be called as such, fair to everyone?
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Post by tsuruchi kasumi on Nov 3, 2014 8:19:18 GMT
I don't really mind one way or another. I know I'll get there eventually, so if you change it, no problem, if you don't, no problem either.
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Bayushi Satomi
Unwanted Betrothed
Scorpion Clan
Posts: 1,080| Likes: 322
Rings: Earth 4 * Fire: 5 *Air 3 * Water 1 * Void 3
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Post by Bayushi Satomi on Nov 3, 2014 10:47:44 GMT
Well, as it doesn't seem a problem as I thought it was, things remain as it is. I apologize for raising a useless discussion. Must trust that when you guys see a problem, you will tell me.
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